myHeartyHeart.com >> Heart Disease Talk >> One Year Since I Started Again
One Year Since I Started Again
Question:
Hi Jenny, inspection: Carmen, I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term.
Alright then. For me the main motivation is fear. I wish I could say it’s because I love the foods and don’t miss carbs. That wouldn’t be the truth though. The pain that’ll come screaming back from the GERD, the never ending hunger, the joint pain from weighing so much and the out-of-control feeling are all waiting for me if I eat carbs in any quantity for even a day. Add to that the longer term fears extant in poorly controlled blood sugar levels and it all adds up to a fairly effective set of mental handcuffs. There *are* other things that factor in – for example the pleasure of doing highly physical pursuits and the satisfaction that stems from being able to do them. I’m in vastly better shape at 36 than I was at 16. I can be more of a partner to my husband and a more active mother for my daughter (not to mention a better role model). The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it.
<Wry smile I don’t think there’s a way to instill fear in someone who doesn’t wish to be scared – and even if there were I wouldn’t do it. All the long termers can do is continue on and hope that the results (especially healthwise, although some people do it for aesthetic reasons) speak for themselves. There are always folks, like my dad, who can eat the same ascetic meal three times a day for 45 years without a second thought–basically because they don’t get pleasure from food. I can understand how someone like that can stay on a low carb diet for life without a second thought. Reading Dr. Bernstein’s book I get the impression he falls into that catagory too. But for those of us who find food to be one of life’s major pleasures, there’s no getting around the fact its a challenge.
You’re preaching to the choir on this one. One thing I’m known for is my baking ability. I love to bake, and I always loved the result. Cooking in general has always been one of my greatest pleasures, with eating a close second. Low carbing hasn’t taken away my ability to cook or bake, but it has greatly reduced the ability to enjoy the end results. Since it’s so frustrating for me to bake I seldom do so any more – low carb baking doesn’t produce proper results because the materials just don’t have the same properties. For me, just how big a challenge it was became clear when I got the cancer diagnosis. My immediate thought was that if I was going to die, what a terrible waste it had been that I’d avoided all that wonderful pastry and restaurant cooking all those years. I made up for it in the next couple months. But even now I always have in the back of my mind the thought that if the melanoma comes back, I’m going on a cruise and spending the whole trip at the buffet. <g
Understood. Essentially low carb is a trade-off for me. I trade the foods I’d rather have for a potentially longer/higher quality life. You know, looking back on what I wrote I kind of hope not too many newbies read it. If they’re here with no serious health issues I doubt they’ll understand my (or your) POV. Perhaps some of those with no serious health problems who’ve kept it off long term will chime in here…..talk about your exclusive groups though. :-) Take care, Carmen
Response:
I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. I’m at about 4.5 years at this point. I’ve only kept off half of my loss but that’s a hell of a lot better than gaining back 105% of it the why so many folks who quit any plan have happen.
I’m currently just a couple of months away from 5 years on LC. While I’m not at my lowest right now, I still have maintained my 110+ loss for over 3 years now. So for me low carbing is not just the way I eat, but it’s the way I believe I *should* eat. No matter how often I fall off the wagon, I know that the right thing to do is to get back on the wagon. It is my normal way of eating, all the way down through my belief system. While I mostly LC, I also have periods of time off of LC — sometimes of a few weeks in a row. That works for me because of my fitness level, the amount of training that I do, plus my LBM. But I’m always more than ready to get back to strict LC because I feel so much better on LC than off LC. I often believe that maybe those who go off and stay off of LC may not have gotten past the idea that LC is just for weight loss. That maybe they didn’t strongly see/feel the positive effects of not having large amounts of gluten, dairy or sugar in their daily diets. Therefore all they feel LC will do is help them drop a few numbers on the scale — and the scale is something a lot of people can avoid. The thing is high dropout rate is common on every type of plan. If anyone ever solves that problem, the solution is likely to work for *every* type of plan. For that matter, it would likely lead to folks going out in their garages and completing all their old unfinished projects, too. Chuckle.
Personally, I feel that ‘dropout’ and quitting problems are base in the hardwiring of the brain that triggers instant gratification. Certain and immediate gratification is the default switch and it takes a whole lot of effort to bypass that trigger and work in the realm of delayed success. That donut might be wonderful now, but it takes a lot of mental exercise to get the brain to realize that after taking in that donut you’re feel lousy and that repeating that cycle over time will harm you by way of too much BF. You have to rewire, with conscience effort sometimes to try and lay out a different thought pattern — and even then that triggers instant gratification switch can flip. — Rudy LC since 1/98 Remove the Z from my address to respond. "It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!" -Emiliano Zapata Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at: http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm
Response:
Hi Jenny, inspection: Carmen, Thanks for a very thoughtful reply. When we aren’t squabbling about sugar alcohols we have a great deal in common!
True enough. 
Baking and cooking was a huge part of my life before I became diabetic, and like you, I’ve found that LC cooking does not satisfy me in the same way.
The allowable stuff just doesn’t behave the same way, does it? The few low-carb things I’ve baked and allowed others to try didn’t elicit the reaction my regular stuff does. "That’s not bad" doesn’t cut it – especially when that’s what my own reaction is as well. During the year I went off low carb, one of the things I enjoyed most was being able to do some fancy cooking for my son during the last year before he left home. I felt really sad that he’d been too young to appreciate the stuff I used to make before I started low carbing, Back when I was cooking he was such a finicky eater he wouldn’t eat anything fancy. Then suddenly he grew up and got sophisticated. I wanted him to have some memories of "mom’s cooking" that weren’t just meat and veg.
For folks who didn’t relish baking and/or cooking before low carb there isn’t that loss. If you’re like me in that respect (and it seems you are) one aspect of who you were seen as is "good cook". It was one of the areas you stood out in, and probably part of why you enjoyed doing it so much. Low carb baking just can’t compete in the same arena with regular baked goods for a non-LC audience. If you’re used to being the standout you end up losing that since having all that stuff around is just too hard on a regular basis. I’ve often wondered if that’s how pretty women feel when their looks start to go… BTW, from the looks of that son of yours any time he’s home to visit I suspect you’re safe in thinking anything you make won’t be around too long – he looks like he has pretty high fuel requirements. <G But "fear" works very well for me, too. Since my history of drug reactions means I can’t take the meds that are the next step in controlling blood sugar means, it’s either low carb for me or shooting insulin. Since I’m severely insulin resistant, shooting insulin would probably mean hastening heart disease.
Fear. It stinks, but it works. At least there’s a slow growth of awareness of the value of cutting carbs now in the outside world which makes it a tiny bit easier to do the diet. I no longer get the "you’re destroying your kidneys" speech when I ask for something without the bread.
Isn’t it odd to walk into a store and see items specifically aimed at low carbers? Sure, a lot of them are overpriced crap, but think back even a year and the difference is startling. BTW, did you see that the ADA decreased the upper boundary of normal fasting plasma glucose to 100 mg/dl? If doctors pay any attention to that at all, it should wake a lot more people up to the fact that their "normal" blood sugar is not normal at all.
Yes, and the cynical part of my brain can’t help but think that the average managed health care system isn’t going to be too keen about shelling out more to treat people who "weren’t sick until the ADA said so". I doubt that even a lot of caring physicians are going to be convinced that people with FG in that range are at any real risk without a mountain of studies to back the ADA’s position. The evidence of damage for those people isn’t going to be an easy sell at all. I’ll be interested to see if there’s any real move to implement the ADA’s new guidelines. If I had to place a bet, I’d bet against it. :-( Take care, Carmen
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Carmen, Thanks for a very thoughtful reply. When we aren’t squabbling about sugar alcohols we have a great deal in common! Baking and cooking was a huge part of my life before I became diabetic, and like you, I’ve found that LC cooking does not satisfy me in the same way. During the year I went off low carb, one of the things I enjoyed most was being able to do some fancy cooking for my son during the last year before he left home. I felt really sad that he’d been too young to appreciate the stuff I used to make before I started low carbing, Back when I was cooking he was such a finicky eater he wouldn’t eat anything fancy. Then suddenly he grew up and got sophisticated. I wanted him to have some memories of "mom’s cooking" that weren’t just meat and veg.
[snip] This all sounds very familiar here too. I used to love to cook and bake. Then my daughter became very finicky. I eventually stopped cooking and baking a lot. Now, with this WOE, I am cooking more, but a lot of it is experimental and not too intriguing to the picky one. I almost feel like I have forgotten how to cook over the years. I do hope that when my daughter decides she likes to eat, and I have more latitude from that perspective, I can please both of us. — Jean B.
Response:
Hi Jenny, inspection: But I’m going into my 5th year of low carbing now. That puts me in a very small company. Indeed, I’d really like to hear from anyone who has made it through 4 years on the diet with your comments, suggestions, and insights into how to keep at it long term!
That’s a major accomplishment, and I’ve noticed there’s a tendency for the long termers to be those with compelling medical reasons to stay the course. As for suggestions from those of us who’re 4-year-plus LCers I don’t think you’d listen to anything I say so no sense in taking the time I guess. Congratulations on the milestone anyway. Take care, Carmen
Response:
Carmen, I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. Two years ago my endocrinologist told me that he’d known for years that a low carb diet worked great to control diabetes, but in his experience, people did not stay on it and when they went off they really messed themselves up. The recent study that matched people on the 4 popular diets found a 50% drop out rate for Atkins and Ornish–the two diets requiring the most adaptation. The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. There are always folks, like my dad, who can eat the same ascetic meal three times a day for 45 years without a second thought–basically because they don’t get pleasure from food. I can understand how someone like that can stay on a low carb diet for life without a second thought. Reading Dr. Bernstein’s book I get the impression he falls into that catagory too. But for those of us who find food to be one of life’s major pleasures, there’s no getting around the fact its a challenge. For me, just how big a challenge it was became clear when I got the cancer diagnosis. My immediate thought was that if I was going to die, what a terrible waste it had been that I’d avoided all that wonderful pastry and restaurant cooking all those years. I made up for it in the next couple months. But even now I always have in the back of my mind the thought that if the melanoma comes back, I’m going on a cruise and spending the whole trip at the buffet. <g — Jenny Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address! Weight: 168.5/137 Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 – HBa1c 5.2 10/03 Low Carb 9/1998 – 8/2001 and 11/10/02 – Now http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings * Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats * Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jenny, inspection: But I’m going into my 5th year of low carbing now. That puts me in a very small company. Indeed, I’d really like to hear from anyone who has made it through 4 years on the diet with your comments, suggestions, and insights into how to keep at it long term! That’s a major accomplishment, and I’ve noticed there’s a tendency for the long termers to be those with compelling medical reasons to stay the course. As for suggestions from those of us who’re 4-year-plus LCers I don’t think you’d listen to anything I say so no sense in taking the time I guess. Congratulations on the milestone anyway. Take care, Carmen
Response:
Rosie, You’ve been low carbing longer than I have. Have you been able to stay on plan the whole time? If so, you have got to be one of the newgroup champions by now! — Jenny Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address! Weight: 168.5/137 Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 – HBa1c 5.2 10/03 Low Carb 9/1998 – 8/2001 and 11/10/02 – Now http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings * Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats * Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i switched my way of eating because i got FAT from eating too many sweets, after quitting smoking. as a side benefit, my arthritic pain and my depression seem to be much better controlled! — read and post daily, it works! rosie it ain’t what they call you, it’s what you answer to. Hi Jenny, inspection: Carmen, I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. Alright then. For me the main motivation is fear. I wish I could say it’s because I love the foods and don’t miss carbs. That wouldn’t be the truth though. The pain that’ll come screaming back from the GERD, the never ending hunger, the joint pain from weighing so much and the out-of-control feeling are all waiting for me if I eat carbs in any quantity for even a day. Add to that the longer term fears extant in poorly controlled blood sugar levels and it all adds up to a fairly effective set of mental handcuffs. There *are* other things that factor in – for example the pleasure of doing highly physical pursuits and the satisfaction that stems from being able to do them. I’m in vastly better shape at 36 than I was at 16. I can be more of a partner to my husband and a more active mother for my daughter (not to mention a better role model). The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. <Wry smile I don’t think there’s a way to instill fear in someone who doesn’t wish to be scared – and even if there were I wouldn’t do it. All the long termers can do is continue on and hope that the results (especially healthwise, although some people do it for aesthetic reasons) speak for themselves. There are always folks, like my dad, who can eat the same ascetic meal three times a day for 45 years without a second thought–basically because they don’t get pleasure from food. I can understand how someone like that can stay on a low carb diet for life without a second thought. Reading Dr. Bernstein’s book I get the impression he falls into that catagory too. But for those of us who find food to be one of life’s major pleasures, there’s no getting around the fact its a challenge. You’re preaching to the choir on this one. One thing I’m known for is my baking ability. I love to bake, and I always loved the result. Cooking in general has always been one of my greatest pleasures, with eating a close second. Low carbing hasn’t taken away my ability to cook or bake, but it has greatly reduced the ability to enjoy the end results. Since it’s so frustrating for me to bake I seldom do so any more – low carb baking doesn’t produce proper results because the materials just don’t have the same properties. For me, just how big a challenge it was became clear when I got the cancer diagnosis. My immediate thought was that if I was going to die, what a terrible waste it had been that I’d avoided all that wonderful pastry and restaurant cooking all those years. I made up for it in the next couple months. But even now I always have in the back of my mind the thought that if the melanoma comes back, I’m going on a cruise and spending the whole trip at the buffet. <g Understood. Essentially low carb is a trade-off for me. I trade the foods I’d rather have for a potentially longer/higher quality life. You know, looking back on what I wrote I kind of hope not too many newbies read it. If they’re here with no serious health issues I doubt they’ll understand my (or your) POV. Perhaps some of those with no serious health problems who’ve kept it off long term will chime in here…..talk about your exclusive groups though. :-) Take care, Carmen
Response:
Carmen, Thanks for a very thoughtful reply. When we aren’t squabbling about sugar alcohols we have a great deal in common! Baking and cooking was a huge part of my life before I became diabetic, and like you, I’ve found that LC cooking does not satisfy me in the same way. During the year I went off low carb, one of the things I enjoyed most was being able to do some fancy cooking for my son during the last year before he left home. I felt really sad that he’d been too young to appreciate the stuff I used to make before I started low carbing, Back when I was cooking he was such a finicky eater he wouldn’t eat anything fancy. Then suddenly he grew up and got sophisticated. I wanted him to have some memories of "mom’s cooking" that weren’t just meat and veg. But "fear" works very well for me, too. Since my history of drug reactions means I can’t take the meds that are the next step in controlling blood sugar means, it’s either low carb for me or shooting insulin. Since I’m severely insulin resistant, shooting insulin would probably mean hastening heart disease. At least there’s a slow growth of awareness of the value of cutting carbs now in the outside world which makes it a tiny bit easier to do the diet. I no longer get the "you’re destroying your kidneys" speech when I ask for something without the bread. BTW, did you see that the ADA decreased the upper boundary of normal fasting plasma glucose to 100 mg/dl? If doctors pay any attention to that at all, it should wake a lot more people up to the fact that their "normal" blood sugar is not normal at all. — Jenny Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address! Weight: 168.5/137 Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 – HBa1c 5.2 10/03 Low Carb 9/1998 – 8/2001 and 11/10/02 – Now http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings * Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats * Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jenny, inspection: Carmen, I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. Alright then. For me the main motivation is fear. I wish I could say it’s because I love the foods and don’t miss carbs. That wouldn’t be the truth though. The pain that’ll come screaming back from the GERD, the never ending hunger, the joint pain from weighing so much and the out-of-control feeling are all waiting for me if I eat carbs in any quantity for even a day. Add to that the longer term fears extant in poorly controlled blood sugar levels and it all adds up to a fairly effective set of mental handcuffs. There *are* other things that factor in – for example the pleasure of doing highly physical pursuits and the satisfaction that stems from being able to do them. I’m in vastly better shape at 36 than I was at 16. I can be more of a partner to my husband and a more active mother for my daughter (not to mention a better role model). The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. <Wry smile I don’t think there’s a way to instill fear in someone who doesn’t wish to be scared – and even if there were I wouldn’t do it. All the long termers can do is continue on and hope that the results (especially healthwise, although some people do it for aesthetic reasons) speak for themselves. There are always folks, like my dad, who can eat the same ascetic meal three times a day for 45 years without a second thought–basically because they don’t get pleasure from food. I can understand how someone like that can stay on a low carb diet for life without a second thought. Reading Dr. Bernstein’s book I get the impression he falls into that catagory too. But for those of us who find food to be one of life’s major pleasures, there’s no getting around the fact its a challenge. You’re preaching to the choir on this one. One thing I’m known for is my baking ability. I love to bake, and I always loved the result. Cooking in general has always been one of my greatest pleasures, with eating a close second. Low carbing hasn’t taken away my ability to cook or bake, but it has greatly reduced the ability to enjoy the end results. Since it’s so frustrating for me to bake I seldom do so any more – low carb baking doesn’t produce proper results because the materials just don’t have the same properties. For me, just how big a challenge it was became clear when I got the cancer diagnosis. My immediate thought was that if I was going to die, what a terrible waste it had been that I’d avoided all that wonderful pastry and restaurant cooking all those years. I made up for it in the next couple months. But even now I always have in the back of my mind the thought that if the melanoma comes back, I’m going on a cruise and spending the whole trip at the buffet. <g Understood. Essentially low carb is a trade-off for me. I trade the foods I’d rather have for a potentially longer/higher quality life. You know, looking back on what I wrote I kind of hope not too many newbies read it. If they’re here with no serious health issues I doubt they’ll understand my (or your) POV. Perhaps some of those with no serious health problems who’ve kept it off long term will chime in here…..talk about your exclusive groups though. :-) Take care, Carmen
Response:
i switched my way of eating because i got FAT from eating too many sweets, after quitting smoking. as a side benefit, my arthritic pain and my depression seem to be much better controlled! — read and post daily, it works! rosie it ain’t what they call you, it’s what you answer to.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jenny, inspection: Carmen, I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. Alright then. For me the main motivation is fear. I wish I could say it’s because I love the foods and don’t miss carbs. That wouldn’t be the truth though. The pain that’ll come screaming back from the GERD, the never ending hunger, the joint pain from weighing so much and the out-of-control feeling are all waiting for me if I eat carbs in any quantity for even a day. Add to that the longer term fears extant in poorly controlled blood sugar levels and it all adds up to a fairly effective set of mental handcuffs. There *are* other things that factor in – for example the pleasure of doing highly physical pursuits and the satisfaction that stems from being able to do them. I’m in vastly better shape at 36 than I was at 16. I can be more of a partner to my husband and a more active mother for my daughter (not to mention a better role model). The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. <Wry smile I don’t think there’s a way to instill fear in someone who doesn’t wish to be scared – and even if there were I wouldn’t do it. All the long termers can do is continue on and hope that the results (especially healthwise, although some people do it for aesthetic reasons) speak for themselves. There are always folks, like my dad, who can eat the same ascetic meal three times a day for 45 years without a second thought–basically because they don’t get pleasure from food. I can understand how someone like that can stay on a low carb diet for life without a second thought. Reading Dr. Bernstein’s book I get the impression he falls into that catagory too. But for those of us who find food to be one of life’s major pleasures, there’s no getting around the fact its a challenge. You’re preaching to the choir on this one. One thing I’m known for is my baking ability. I love to bake, and I always loved the result. Cooking in general has always been one of my greatest pleasures, with eating a close second. Low carbing hasn’t taken away my ability to cook or bake, but it has greatly reduced the ability to enjoy the end results. Since it’s so frustrating for me to bake I seldom do so any more – low carb baking doesn’t produce proper results because the materials just don’t have the same properties. For me, just how big a challenge it was became clear when I got the cancer diagnosis. My immediate thought was that if I was going to die, what a terrible waste it had been that I’d avoided all that wonderful pastry and restaurant cooking all those years. I made up for it in the next couple months. But even now I always have in the back of my mind the thought that if the melanoma comes back, I’m going on a cruise and spending the whole trip at the buffet. <g Understood. Essentially low carb is a trade-off for me. I trade the foods I’d rather have for a potentially longer/higher quality life. You know, looking back on what I wrote I kind of hope not too many newbies read it. If they’re here with no serious health issues I doubt they’ll understand my (or your) POV. Perhaps some of those with no serious health problems who’ve kept it off long term will chime in here…..talk about your exclusive groups though. :-) Take care, Carmen
Response:
I suspect that anyone who has stuck with this diet for four years has quit at some point–if only for a week or two. (Well maybe not the one or two who have perfectly clean homes, neat closets, honor student children and pets who never poop in the house. <g.)
I have *failed* for as long as a month running, but I have never even considered *quitting*. And that’s why I’m still here low carbing. I have tried CAD rather than Atkins for a year, but that’s not really quitting low carbing. And I was really using the CAD rules or portions on the dinner plate and the 60 minute time limit and so on as a why to meet my CCLL (50ish) to CCLM (100ish) maintenance range without the effort of counting. If you view falling off the wagon as quiting, you’ll have troubles in the long run. If you view falling off the wagon as a mistake to be fixed, you’ll remain in the long run.
Response:
If you view falling off the wagon as quiting, you’ll have troubles in the long run. If you view falling off the wagon as a mistake to be fixed, you’ll remain in the long run.
Why not just do it right? why "fall off the wagon?" at all? I don’t get this mentality of "it’s ok to f’up as long as you jump back on the horse" crap. LC gives me the tools to not overeat,. Have I ever eaten something "off-plan"? of course, a small piece of DS’s birthday cake, is that falling off the wagon? I don’t think so because I made allowances for that small piece of cake. Extra exercise, decreased carbs/calories for the rest of the day. For example, when I had the small piece of cake I ordered half of a grilled chicken salad with the dressing on the side, drank water with my meal and made sure to do an extra lap at Curves that morning. It was a planned part of my day. Caused me no weight gain. But giving yourself permission to take days upon days off is just wrong IMO. you are doing yourself a diservice. It is self-sabotage. It says, (to me) I am a f’up. I might as well really blow it. So I don’t think people should be jumping on and off the bandwagon. I think they should commit and stick. plan ahead, treat themselves well and don’t set themselves up for guilt by getting out of control. As usual, JMHO — Lori 220/143/135 LC since 1/17/03 Nov Challenge 145/140 http://community.webshots.com/album/99840928pOTLCx
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Doug Freyburger wrote in response to the quote below by me: The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. That’s a tautology. It can be rephrased this way: Quitting is one huge problem. The only people who get past that are the ones who don’t quit. Okay. True enough. Blue is blue. I suspect that anyone who has stuck with this diet for four years has quit at some point–if only for a week or two. (Well maybe not the one or two who have perfectly clean homes, neat closets, honor student children and pets who never poop in the house. <g.)
I think the thing is, that yes everybody quits, but the ones who succede are those who *keep quiting– as in you have to be *doing something to "quit". revek — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Response:
Doug Freyburger wrote in response to the quote below by me: The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. That’s a tautology. It can be rephrased this way: Quitting is one huge problem. The only people who get past that are the ones who don’t quit. Okay. True enough. Blue is blue.
I suspect that anyone who has stuck with this diet for four years has quit at some point–if only for a week or two. (Well maybe not the one or two who have perfectly clean homes, neat closets, honor student children and pets who never poop in the house. <g.) — Jenny Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address! Weight: 168.5/137 Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 – HBa1c 5.2 10/03 Low Carb 9/1998 – 8/2001 and 11/10/02 – Now http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings * Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats * Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term. I’m at about 4.5 years at this point. I’ve only kept off half of my loss but that’s a hell of a lot better than gaining back 105% of it the why so many folks who quit any plan have happen. How: In martial arts and religious meditation there is "the method of no method". Bluntly, it’s the "just do it" school. No how involved. It’s like Masons, Boy Scouts or Campfire Girls all treating each other as siblings. They just do it, no "how" beyond following the example of others and setting the example for others. I don’t have a system of any specific type. I read up on low carb, noticed that the Atkins process of building up your carb intake to a custom level wasn’t obvious, and I read deeper. I got the biochemistry of it, the dance of the hormone stuff, and so on. I guess with all of that type of study I believe that it’s the right way to eat. Actually believing it’s the right way to eat makes a huge difference. I’m not doing it because it works. Sure, it *does* work. But I’m doing it because I *believe* it works. So for me low carbing is not just the way I eat, but it’s the way I believe I *should* eat. No matter how often I fall off the wagon, I know that the right thing to do is to get back on the wagon. It is my normal way of eating, all the way down through my belief system. I never did believe low fat, not deep down in the depths of my mind. Have you heard of "cognitive dissonance"? With low fatting I always had cognitive dissonance. With low carbing I have no cognitive disonnance. That’s why even when I’m off the wagon, I’m still a low carber, and I’m always getting back on the wagon because that’s just plain what I do. Two years ago my endocrinologist told me that he’d known for years that a low carb diet worked great to control diabetes, but in his experience, people did not stay on it and when they went off they really messed themselves up. The recent study that matched people on the 4 popular diets found a 50% drop out rate for Atkins and Ornish–the two diets requiring the most adaptation. I don’t have any driving medical need. I had back spasms because my spare tire got too big and that’s what drove me to start, but that is not on the same scale. I wasn’t even on painkillers for my back pain. The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it. That’s a tautology. It can be rephrased this way: Quitting is one huge problem. The only people who get past that are the ones who don’t quit. Okay. True enough. Blue is blue. The thing is high dropout rate is common on every type of plan. If anyone ever solves that problem, the solution is likely to work for *every* type of plan. For that matter, it would likely lead to folks going out in their garages and completing all their old unfinished projects, too. Chuckle. Doug Freyburger on Atkins since 1999-06-21
Response:
I’d be very interesting in any observations you’d care to share about how you managed to stay on a low carb diet long term.
I’m at about 4.5 years at this point. I’ve only kept off half of my loss but that’s a hell of a lot better than gaining back 105% of it the why so many folks who quit any plan have happen. How: In martial arts and religious meditation there is "the method of no method". Bluntly, it’s the "just do it" school. No how involved. It’s like Masons, Boy Scouts or Campfire Girls all treating each other as siblings. They just do it, no "how" beyond following the example of others and setting the example for others. I don’t have a system of any specific type. I read up on low carb, noticed that the Atkins process of building up your carb intake to a custom level wasn’t obvious, and I read deeper. I got the biochemistry of it, the dance of the hormone stuff, and so on. I guess with all of that type of study I believe that it’s the right way to eat. Actually believing it’s the right way to eat makes a huge difference. I’m not doing it because it works. Sure, it *does* work. But I’m doing it because I *believe* it works. So for me low carbing is not just the way I eat, but it’s the way I believe I *should* eat. No matter how often I fall off the wagon, I know that the right thing to do is to get back on the wagon. It is my normal way of eating, all the way down through my belief system. I never did believe low fat, not deep down in the depths of my mind. Have you heard of "cognitive dissonance"? With low fatting I always had cognitive dissonance. With low carbing I have no cognitive disonnance. That’s why even when I’m off the wagon, I’m still a low carber, and I’m always getting back on the wagon because that’s just plain what I do. Two years ago my endocrinologist told me that he’d known for years that a low carb diet worked great to control diabetes, but in his experience, people did not stay on it and when they went off they really messed themselves up. The recent study that matched people on the 4 popular diets found a 50% drop out rate for Atkins and Ornish–the two diets requiring the most adaptation.
I don’t have any driving medical need. I had back spasms because my spare tire got too big and that’s what drove me to start, but that is not on the same scale. I wasn’t even on painkillers for my back pain. The high drop out rate is the one huge problem with this diet, and the only people who know anything about how to get past this problem are those of us who have managed to keep at it.
That’s a tautology. It can be rephrased this way: Quitting is one huge problem. The only people who get past that are the ones who don’t quit. Okay. True enough. Blue is blue. The thing is high dropout rate is common on every type of plan. If anyone ever solves that problem, the solution is likely to work for *every* type of plan. For that matter, it would likely lead to folks going out in their garages and completing all their old unfinished projects, too. Chuckle. Doug Freyburger on Atkins since 1999-06-21
Response:
I remembered I’d started low carbing again sometime last November and just looked it up. It was November 10th! It’s been quite a year.The previous fall I’d put on ten pounds after my ill-starred flirtation with Metformin. I felt so much better when I stopped low carbing, due to the low blood sugar problem that I’d developed, that I could not face going back on LC. Instead I’d eaten a moderate carb diet (around 120 a day) filled with low glycemic whole grains and healthy oils (the so-called "Mediterranean Diet") and I’d used Precose to protect my blood sugar. On that regime, I maintained my weight for six months without gaining another pound and kept my blood sugar in the low 6.0% hba1c range . Then my blood pressure started to climb. At a visit to the doctor to discuss the blood pressure, the doctor noticed a dark spot at the base of my neck and made an appointment with a skin doctor. A week later I was diagnosed with melanoma. I underwent a very painful surgery, followed by the discovery that the lesion had grown back on the edges. Meanwhile, my blood pressure climbed until it was so high that I had to go to the hospital to have and MRI and nuclear scan to see if my kidney arteries were blocked. The medication they gave me for the blood pressure didn’t work and my blood pressure kept surging. I was terrified I’d have a stroke like my grandma did at the same age. I took comfort in ice cream, my favorite comfort food and within a month I’d gained another 6 lbs–reaching the weight I’d been at when I’d first turned to low carbing in 1998. Finally, on November 10, I started low carbing again because there didn’t seem to be anything else I could do for my health. For the first couple weeks after the loss of the initial water weight I stalled. Then I reread Dr. Bernstein’s book and a couple of new things leaped out at me this time–most notably the importance of keeping protein portions under control and his technique for balancing out low blood sugar swings. My doctor then put me on a new blood pressure drug which lowers insulin resistance and boomo–down went my weight! Today I weighed in at 139. That’s 29 1/2 lbs less than where I was a year ago. I’m wearing pants that have a waistband 6 inches smaller than those I wore a year ago. I look great with no clothes on (or as great as you’re going to look at 55 <g). My blood pressure rarely goes above 125/80 and mostly is in the 110/60 range. I had a second melanoma surgery in December. The pathology reports came back saying that both lesions were still on the surface, so supposedly I’m okay. My latest hba1c was 5.2. I’ve been going to the gym and working out 3 – 5 times a week since late February and have some fairly impressive leg muscles. The challenge for me now is to stay on a low carb regimen that is generous enough that I can avoid the burnout that derailed me in 2001 after 3 years on plan. I’m doing that by incorporating small doses of off-plan food in my diet so that nothing becomes a "forbidden fruit." I’m also being much more aware of low blood sugars since it was a prolonged period of low blood sugar (accompanied by feeling half dead) that caused me to go off the low carb plan in 2001. I also track calories and carbs with software every day. I’m finding it much more challenging to stay on maintenance than I did when I was actively losing weight. When I experimented with not logging food last month, I gained a couple pounds although I kept my blood sugar completely normal, which means I was keeping my carbs low as I thought I was. Calories, not carbs, seem to be my downfall. It seems that my body simply doesn’t need many calories. But I’m going into my 5th year of low carbing now. That puts me in a very small company. Indeed, I’d really like to hear from anyone who has made it through 4 years on the diet with your comments, suggestions, and insights into how to keep at it long term! — Jenny Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address! Weight: 168.5/137 Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 – HBa1c 5.2 10/03 Low Carb 9/1998 – 8/2001 and 11/10/02 – Now http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings * Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats * Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes